Did Enhanced Interrogations Work? Do We Need An Investigation?
I tell you, I’m starting to feel like Glenn “Sock Puppet” Greenwald, Excitable Andy, and the nuts from The World Can’t Wait, considering all the posts as of late I have written regarded enhanced interrogations, but this subject is fascinating. It highlights the pusillanimous and September 10th mentalities of the Left, who are way more upset about the harsh treatment of Al Qaeda members who would as as soon as slit American throats as look at them than protecting American lives and property, not too mention how they have politicized the issue. Case in point
News Analysis – At Core of Detainee Fight: Did Methods Stop Attacks?
Even the most exacting truth commission may have a hard time determining for certain whether brutal interrogations conducted by the Central Intelligence Agency helped keep the country safe.
Scott Shane at the NY Times has already shown in the first paragraph that this news analysis belongs on the opinion pages with his “brutal interrogations”crack.
Last week’s release of long-secret Justice Department interrogation memorandums has given rise to starkly opposing narratives about what, if anything, was gained by the C.I.A.’s use of waterboarding, wall-slamming and other physical pressure to shock and intimidate Qaeda operatives.
And therein lies part of the problem: the Left makes it seem as if the detainees were getting the snot beaten out of them, when, in fact, in the vast majority of cases, the situations were carefully controlled and meant to leave little if no physical damage to the little darlings. It was their heads we were messing with, and, despite what the Left, including the Obambi administration has said, worked.
Even President Obama’s new director of national intelligence, Dennis C. Blair, wrote in a memorandum to his staff last week that “high value information came from interrogations in which these methods were used,” an assertion left out when the memorandum was edited for public release. By contrast, Mr. Obama and most of his top aides have argued that the use of those methods betrayed American values — and anyway, produced unreliable information. Those are a convenient pair of opinions, of course: the moral balancing would be far trickier if the C.I.A. methods were demonstrated to have been crucial in disrupting major plots.
Four successive C.I.A. directors have made similar claims, and the most recent, Michael V. Hayden, said in January that he believed the methods “got the maximum amount of information” from prisoners, citing specifically Abu Zubaydah and Khalid Shaikh Mohammed, the chief 9/11 plotter.
Many intelligence officials, including some opposed to the brutal methods, confirm that the program produced information of great value, including tips on early-stage schemes to attack tall buildings on the West Coast and buildings in New York’s financial district and Washington. Interrogation of one Qaeda operative led to tips on finding others, until the leadership of the organization was decimated. Removing from the scene such dedicated and skilled plotters as Mr. Mohammed, or the Indonesian terrorist known as Hambali, almost certainly prevented future attacks.
So, people in the know are claiming the enhanced techniques worked. The people who are in it for the politics are saying, no. Why?
For both sides, the political stakes are high, as proposals for a national commission to unravel the interrogation story appear to be gaining momentum. Mr. Obama and his allies need to discredit the techniques he has banned. Otherwise, in the event of a future terrorist attack, critics may blame his decision to rein in C.I.A. interrogators.
But if a strong case emerges that the Bush administration authorized torture and got nothing but prisoners’ desperate fabrications in return, that will tarnish what Mr. Bush and Mr. Cheney have claimed as their greatest achievement: preventing new attacks after Sept. 11, 2001.
Hmm, the article seems to be missing a paragraph, one which says “But if a strong case emerges that the Bush administration authorized torture enhanced techniques and got actionable and high value intelligence from the subjects, then President Bush, Dick Cheney, and others will be vindicated.” How did that get left out?
So, what needs to be done? Unfortunately, at this time, after all the caterwauling, hand wringing, panty wetting, an, oh, yes, exposing of the program, there needs to be a release of all the relevant information, and an actual investigation, which includes, according to Congressman Pete Hoekstra, writing in an editorial at the Wall Street Journal
Members of Congress calling for an investigation of the enhanced interrogation program should remember that such an investigation can’t be a selective review of information, or solely focus on the lawyers who wrote the memos, or the low-level employees who carried out this program. I have asked Mr. Blair to provide me with a list of the dates, locations and names of all members of Congress who attended briefings on enhanced interrogation techniques.
Any investigation must include this information as part of a review of those in Congress and the Bush administration who reviewed and supported this program. To get a complete picture of the enhanced interrogation program, a fair investigation will also require that the Obama administration release the memos requested by former Vice President Dick Cheney on the successes of this program.
It’s a shame that it has come to this, but, unfortunately, the next investigation might be in to how an American city turned into a smoking whole while the Obama administration played nice with terrorists and lived on September 10th.
Crossed at Pirate’s Cove
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Posted by William Teach on April 23, 2009 8:48 am
» Filed Under Barack Obama, Delusional Dupes and DUmmies, Democrats, Liberal Media/Bias, National Security, News, RoP, War On Terror
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27 Responses to “Did Enhanced Interrogations Work? Do We Need An Investigation?”
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Torture is not simply physical abuse of those in your custody you simpleton. WHY is that SO incredibly difficult for you and yours to understand?
What we did to these people was worse than physical torture. We stripped them of their personality and made them ours – completely under our control.
And, if this was such a noble exercise, why the hell are military reservists sitting in jail for doing less than what Rumsfeld and Cheney thought was appropriate? Why did the Unitary Executive let their people go to jail for doing what Cheney now claims was so necessary? Why? Doesn’t seem very fair does it? And you supposedly support your troops. Pathetic. Stop the ACLU – go for it, they’ll come after you next.
Eric Holder: Terrorist Detainees Don’t Fall Under Geneva Conventions http://tinyurl.com/5btafl
To quote your fav . . . So? Do you have a thought of your own? What’s your position? How’s it backed up? By this? Please. Strawman – the Geneva Conventions aren’t the only law on this subject. There’s actually US criminal statutes more directly on point. Who give a $h_t about foreign law on the right anyway. Foreign law is for losers.
How about going back to the Janet Reno – Eric Holder – Jamie Gorelick actions that created the intelligence barriers between CIA, FBI, etc which led to the deaths on 9/11. Their actions enabled the man made disasters of the community organizers. They should be prosecuted first and foremost. After that trial, proceed to the next group that protected Americans and let the jury decide with all facts on the table.
and according to the FBI, Bill, the Cheney / Rumsfeld torture program put all those intelligence barriers back up because the FBI, like most every American consulted, viewed torture as illegal and didn’t want to get involved with the CIA on that. next . . .
Waiting for these people to give “examples” as to where these enhanced tactics worked. If these enhanced tactics were so necessary and effective than why did the Bush administration allow our military soldiers be convicted and serve prison sentences for Abu Ghraib? Why didn’t Cheney come out and defend those US soldiers for doing what he now considers effective and necessary? Where were these sleazy officials then who were hiding behind lies while our proud soldiers were being barbecued for simply following orders that they now say were necessary and proven to be effective? Effective or not…prosecute and convict every last one of them for the atrocities they committed on our military soldiers in response for Abu Ghraib. Memos now prove that those soldiers were simply following orders and have and/or currently serving prison sentences for it while these sleazy traitors lied about these “effective” tactics being used and turned their yellow backs on our military. Prosecute them all and send them straight to hell where they belong!!!
po: Let me say this slowly for you in the cheap seats!
Waterboarding may be brutal, it may be nasty, it may even be uncalled for. But it’s not torture. It does not inflict physical pain or damage. It does not destroy the victim. Its sole purpose is to create a sense of terror by arousing deep instinctive reactions against drowning, instincts shared not only by almost all mammals, but almost all vertebrates who don’t happen to be fish. It is effective, it is quick, it leaves no scars and should revolt no one’s conscience.
The only person other than US pilot trainees we know to have been waterboarded is Khalid Sheik Muhhamed. Khalid broke within minutes (the practice involves wrapping the face in towels and then pouring on large quantities of water.) He was waterboarded for one reason alone: he was involved in the 9/11 attack, both preparation and execution, and authorities needed to know if any other such attacks were in store.
The fact is that these terrorist are illegal combatants, we are not fighting recognized national forces with recognized institutions, armies, uniforms or even respects for the laws of war.
They don’t deserve any better treatment that those once afforded to pirates on the high seas; they opened hostilities on 9/11 against mostly civilian’s targets.
Since then, they had never made any concerned efforts to treat any civilians or military personnel that had the misfortune of being captured under the rules of Geneva. That in my opinion put them outside of any protection provided by the convention.
While I know you and the rest of the brain-dead liberals have so much compassion for terrorist that planed and executed the 9/11 attacks, And the poor masterminds of those attacks had to endure waterboarding, sleep deprivation, loud music, tight quarters and panties on the head. WOW!
But where’s your compassion for the 50 million babies aborted since Roe vs Wade and a large number of those babies were late term abortions, so it’s ok to suck the brains out of babies heads and throw them in the trash can (that seems more tortuous to me! unless you think babies in late term feel no pain), but don’t under any circumstances subject a terrorist to a little discomfort or loud music as to avert another attack?
You’re a delusional leftist and should seek some psychiatric help before you hurt yourself or others. (ò¿ó)
brain dead liberals and leftist blah blah blah and msm blah blah blah and whine moan groan and waah waah waah and blah blah blah and thumb-sucking tantrums and liberla blah blah blah.
Anything new? Anything remotely close to solutions, answers or intelligent thought? Anything at all?
Two elections cycles proving that America has undoubtedly rejected your continuous whining about things with providing not a single answer or solution to anything at all while continuing to alienate yourself down to a smoldering nub. You my friend, are the one sitting in the cheap seats.
Po: If mental abuse is your accusation? Then I guess all Normal Americans can bring moonbat liberals to court on charges of torture.
Your words speak for themselves and your liberal childish temper tantrums speak volumes about your lack of character or personality.
Your argument is weak, incoherent and manipulative nonsense!
Hearsay! Inadmissible! Case Dismissed Fool! (ò¿ó)
Mack, say it as slow as you want — you probably need to speak slowly with all those rocks in your mouth and head — and then go do some research on the war crimes trials of the Germans and Japanese after WWII. Then talk to me about torture and waterboarding.
Being patriotic is not blindly repeating everything the government tells you when it is in the hands of the GOP and dismissing everything it says when the “Left / Communists / Socialists / Fascist / etc.” get in power.
The facts are the facts and they transcend party. For all you know I am Ronald Reagan’s long lost daughter or Rush Limbaugh lurking. You don’t know squat about my politics or beliefs.
The facts are that those picked up by the DOD and CIA overseas may or may not be terrorist or enemy combatants. Interrogations might provide answers. But we’ll never know for most because once you torture, even if they are what you say you lose the right to convict and many won’t even believe because the courts view the evidence as tainted (the reason, because hundreds of years of human history have shown that a tortured person will say just about anything). Instead of learning what you’ve got, you just want to presume and torture based on your misguided presumption. YOU and yours are cowards and frankly un-American.
Yet you claim to be concerned. You want to talk about death and abortion – how’s about all the people – humans one and all – you’ve killed in Iraq on this little crusade without merit. There was no Iraq – AQ connection. Or how about all the “enemy combatants” that weren’t who were killed in Black Sites. Those who did this were simply traitors.
Syntax: blah blah blah? If that’s the best you moonbat liberals can come up with, post your childish leftwing drivel over at comedy central!
Solution about what you ignorant dimwit?
This is a political witch-hunt by Soros and the leftwing democrats, it’s smoke and mirrors! A diversion from Doh!Bamas incompetence and failure on foreign and domestic problems and issues.
Oh by the way, don’t you mean 2 years when Republicans take back the Senate and shut Huh-huh huh-huh Doh!Bama huh-huh down!
“Hope and Change” your diaper! It’s stinkin up the place!
“A useful idiot is a person who is a gullible, sometimes well intentioned, apologist for Communism, Marxism, Leninism and extreme forms of Socialism”.
Vladimir Lenin coined the term.
Have you taken your meds today? You seem agitated and incoherent! Have you had a pregnancy test lately? This can also cause irrational thought at times, maybe when your welfare check hits your mailbox, that will cheer you up!
This is not a diagnosis, just an observation! (ò¿ó)
Oh, and I almost forgot, re: this – “It is effective, it is quick, it leaves no scars and should revolt no one’s conscience.” Really . . . that’s why it was done over 100 times to one guy in a month. That’s not very effective or quick. As for scars, well, if it works the way you claim – and conjures up those deep seeded fears – then there are scars. I’ve seen the videos, it’s really quite revolting, but I bet you get excited watching it, sort of like a car crash.
po and the other dimwit: Facts? Liberal Facts? You mean all your Regurgitated DU, Koz, Moveon and Huffpo BS? You can take your uneducated, brainwashed and indoctrinated (Bleep) down the ramp tramp!
Nobodies buying the crap! Lemmings! (ò¿ó)
The facts are the facts, my brother Mack, whether you like them or not. They don’t lie and they aren’t worded funny to make them sound nice like enhanced interrogation techniques versus torture.
They are taken from the numerous documents which have been released to date as well as the recorded history of Man. They are not liberal facts. They are not conservative facts, but, in case you missed it, even John Boehner now calls it torture. He’s just mad we’re talking about it. Guess that’s Compassionate conservatism for you.
po: By the way, what is po short for? poo poo? How appropriate! And I’m not your brother!
My brother’s Love God and Country! (ò¿ó)
nope, short for my name, but you keep insulting. that seems what you’re best at. And if you love God, then you’re my brother, or did you skip that Sunday school class like you did when they were explaining the commandments such as ‘thou shalt not kill’, ‘love they neighbor’ and what was that that Jesus taught us . . . wait, I think I remember, oh, yeah, that thing about “turning the other cheek.” Yeah, you love God alright, about as much as you love this country. Judging by your comments, it ain’t much at all. Have a nice life.
Po: “turning the other cheek.”? That’s what the liberals do best! Wave the white flag and run!
I didn’t say I was a Saint fool! (ò¿ó)
Pick and chose what Golden Rules to live by, eh? Good Christian you ain’t. You don’t love God. You certainly don’t love Country. You just love yourself. Like most Americans you’re nothing but a raging hypocrite. Enjoy hell, it’s made for you (and paved with good intentions).
Mack and PO are the types that can faithfully be relied upon to prove points made by Liberals. More of the typical thumb-sucking tantrums and blaming the Left and Liberals with there tin-foil hat conspiracies.
“solutions to what you dimwit?” <– says it all right there!!!
And thank you PO for bringing up the Japanese treatment of POWs. Did you know that some of the Japanese were executed for waterboarding our POWs? Duhhhh…think before you speak much?
The problem with you miserable narcistic schoolyard bullies is that you never appreciated the many common causes that people agree with you on many issues. Instead, you would find that one difference of opinion that someone might have with you and label them “liberal” ot “leftist” or “moonbat” and start your WAAAAAAAhhhhh thumbsucking tantrums and spew out extremist childish nonsense. Its funny if you think about it but unfortunately, you miserable whiners have alienated yourselves down to a smoldering nub. Quite pathetic really but you’ve managed to drag the GOP down into your miserble cesspool with you and now they’re stuck there with you and 2 election cycles have proven the devastating cost of your extremism and hypocrisy and basic childish schoolyard bully nonsense. That and refusing to take responsibility for yourselves is always a plus.
I for one realize that the only threat you pose is to the republicans in forcing them to have to have Rush Limbaugh as the leader of the party. Freakin tragic!!! On behalf of the Democrats, I wish to thank each and every one of you for the tremendous amount of support and work you have done for us on the past two election cycles. Your work is invaluable and greatly apreciated and the next time the DailyKos has a party, you guys are your political effectiveness has guaranteed you a place on the VIP list.
nevermind mack…you have coherent thought.
Syntax: We’ll go to your Koz party, and next time we go hunting, you are more then welcome to join us!
I’ll even set up your blind for you!
Who said I was a Republican fool?
Hey…I just realized how right I really am!!! Mack and PO are both Conservatives having a difference of opinion on one little subject and out comes the “Liberal” and “Leftist” labels against each other out to alienate each other even further. That is some incredibly funny stuff. Proves my point as to how truly marginalized you have become thanks to your self-alinating nonsense and why the Republicans need to kick you people to the curb before its too late.
Syntax: po is no conservative, he’s just another Soros moonbat liberal like yourself just waiting for that monthly welfare check and working the conservative boards on the tax payers dime!
And still…the original question was avoided. If these enhanced tactics are so defendable now by Cheney, Rove and the likes then WHY were they not defended nor were the US soldiers defended during the Abu Ghraib situation. The Bush Administration labeled them “bad apples” for what we now know was actions that were following orders. Goos soldiers were dishonorably discharged, prosecuted, convicted and served prison sentences for what these memos now prove, we’re following orders. The C.O.’s instructed them to follow the commands of the CIA interrogators who were “running the show”. The Bush Administration can defend these tactics now as being necessary and effective but hid like cowards behind lies when these men and women in uniform we’re being thrown to the wolves after Abu Ghraib was exposed.
I demand the the Obama Administration pardon these soldiers right now and release the one who is still imprisoned!
I demand that the US military change their discharge status to “Honorable” since we now know they were following orders.
I demand the US Justice Department prosecute and convict the Bush Administration for not defending the soldiers who were carrying out the orders they now find so convenient to defend! It is an unspeakable act of treason to do what these turncoat, yellow-backed, sleazy cowards did to their own men and women in uniform defending our country.
Syntax : don’t let the illusion of being in charge fool you!
The Military, CIA, FBI, DEA, NSA local and state law enforcement are predominately conservative.
“I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic;
Does this ring a bell leftist?
There’s a big difference between being in change and an empty suit sitting in the oval office saying they’re in charge!
The Military loved and respected Bush, I don’t think they feel the same for Hussein.
The military loved and respected Bush? Are you on drugs? Perhaps you should Google the memo from all 4 (thats FOUR) Judge Advocate Generals (Marines, Navy, Army, Air Force) concerning the use of torture dimwit. Have the balls to read it? Not Liberal or Leftist propaganda but memos from the top JAGs of our military.
Go to YouTube and view Secretary of Defense’s press conference from today concerning the use of torture. In fact, instead of self-pacifying yourself with Right-wing propaganda, go to Google and download these memos from the military concerning the use of torture. Go ahead and do it buddy. Come on!!! Don’t pacify yourself with right-wing talking points from unpatriotic cowards who don’t have a cajones to serve their country. Those right-wing pundits who were silent when those Abu Ghraib US soldiers were having their lives ruined beyond repair who only now, have the balls to defend what they didn’t have the balls to defend then.
Syntax : YouTube and MTV News that’s your sources? Boring Yaaaawn! Leftwing propaganda!
You asked me if I’m on drugs? No! Does your mama still work nights?
Only ignorant weak-minded homosexuals and young easily manipulated young girls are stupid enough to believe that communist drivel!
Which one are you?
Doh!Bama is a one term mistake!
65 million voted for Obama
57 million voted for McCain
674k voted for Nader
497k voted for Barr
179k voted for Baldwin
145k voted for McKinney
299,398,484 total population
225,746,457 total population over 18 years
122,394,724 total number of voters
54% of population voted.
There’s 46% of the population that didn’t vote for any candidate.
There are roughly 224,437,959 people that identify themselves as Christian’s in America, most of which are not liberal by any means.
The majority of black Christians voted for Doh!Bama, some White Christians as well, because they were willing to give Doh!Bama the benefit of the doubt that he was actually a Christian with principles and conviction and that the bumper sticker slogan of “Change” actually meant something.
The choice was between a socialist Doh!Bama and a liberal McCain, this wasn’t enough to bring more Christians Conservative out to votes for McCain, Christians are already seeing Doh!Bama start attacking their rights to free religious expression, with his hate speech law; that along will bring Christians out to vote for a Republican in droves, They are waking up fool! And the words getting around!
People all over the country are starting to wake up to this moron’s socialist/marxist agenda.
Doh!Bama got 65 million votes last election, he probably has lost half those people and it’s only the first month (the people that fell for the bumper sticker slogan of “change”), their just now realizing that this wasn’t the change they had in mind.
Acorn better start their fraudulent balloting early if they ever want to get them numbers again.