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	<title>Comments on: Obama Links McCain to Abromoff, McCain Fires Back Linking Obama to Ayers</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/</link>
	<description>Beating Them With Their Own Sickle And Hammer</description>
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		<title>By: dinosaur</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/comment-page-1/#comment-94524</link>
		<dc:creator>dinosaur</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 18:09:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10425#comment-94524</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;That is irrelevant, just because somebody used to associate with another person that did bad deeds doesn’t make them evil too.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

If they shield them it bloody well does though.

&lt;blockquote&gt;Willful ignorance abounds…….. and the grass roots of the Obama believers are plainly childish, ignorant and deluded.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Bang on, OMMAG though I think you are being too polite.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>That is irrelevant, just because somebody used to associate with another person that did bad deeds doesn’t make them evil too.</p></blockquote>
<p>If they shield them it bloody well does though.</p>
<blockquote><p>Willful ignorance abounds…….. and the grass roots of the Obama believers are plainly childish, ignorant and deluded.</p></blockquote>
<p>Bang on, OMMAG though I think you are being too polite.</p>
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		<title>By: OMMAG</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/comment-page-1/#comment-94510</link>
		<dc:creator>OMMAG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 16:54:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10425#comment-94510</guid>
		<description>Are Americans stupid enough to believe that anyone on that list of past associates ... who remain current supporters and associates of Barack Hussain Obama ... are anything BUT America Haters and corrupters?

Willful ignorance abounds........ and the grass roots of the Obama believers are plainly childish, ignorant and deluded.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Are Americans stupid enough to believe that anyone on that list of past associates &#8230; who remain current supporters and associates of Barack Hussain Obama &#8230; are anything BUT America Haters and corrupters?</p>
<p>Willful ignorance abounds&#8230;&#8230;.. and the grass roots of the Obama believers are plainly childish, ignorant and deluded.</p>
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		<title>By: monique</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/comment-page-1/#comment-94502</link>
		<dc:creator>monique</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 15:21:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10425#comment-94502</guid>
		<description>Are Americans really that stupid to believe that any person is simply guilty by association? If  that&#039;s the case, hardly any one of us would get any where in life based on people we&#039;ve worked with or once befriended. I know for me, I don&#039;t always agree with my mother let alone my pastor but I guess that somehow would make me an unlikely candidate.  Now who one chose to do business with-lobbyists especially those flying around on planes with you- should be looked at. In my opinion, where your support and money is coming from is more important since that can influence your policy making-usually benefitting a few to the exclusion  of the many.  But once again, the Republican party is good at what it does-diverting attention from their illegal acts by pointing out sensationalized non-issues of their opponent&#039;s that pander to a certain group of people.  When will we learn-think  for yourself people?!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Are Americans really that stupid to believe that any person is simply guilty by association? If  that&#8217;s the case, hardly any one of us would get any where in life based on people we&#8217;ve worked with or once befriended. I know for me, I don&#8217;t always agree with my mother let alone my pastor but I guess that somehow would make me an unlikely candidate.  Now who one chose to do business with-lobbyists especially those flying around on planes with you- should be looked at. In my opinion, where your support and money is coming from is more important since that can influence your policy making-usually benefitting a few to the exclusion  of the many.  But once again, the Republican party is good at what it does-diverting attention from their illegal acts by pointing out sensationalized non-issues of their opponent&#8217;s that pander to a certain group of people.  When will we learn-think  for yourself people?!</p>
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		<title>By: Jean</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/comment-page-1/#comment-94497</link>
		<dc:creator>Jean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 14:57:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10425#comment-94497</guid>
		<description>Obama was 9 years old during Ayer&#039;s questionable behavior.  

Ayers and Obama served on a board together, Obama did not appoint Ayers to the board but had to work with him just like he has to work with those right wing conservative corrupt republicans in the senate.  Obama may not agree with the Republicans/or like the things they do, but he has to work with them. He has to reach across the aisle.

Ayers did not go to prison, but Jack Abramoff did.  John McCain was a grown man during the Abramoff&#039;s issue and it was McCain&#039;s decision to cozy up to one of the central figures in the Republican culture of corruption.&quot;    Barack Obama was 9 years old during the Ayers issue.

Republican&#039;s grasping at straws and trying to throw the American public another strawman.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Obama was 9 years old during Ayer&#8217;s questionable behavior.  </p>
<p>Ayers and Obama served on a board together, Obama did not appoint Ayers to the board but had to work with him just like he has to work with those right wing conservative corrupt republicans in the senate.  Obama may not agree with the Republicans/or like the things they do, but he has to work with them. He has to reach across the aisle.</p>
<p>Ayers did not go to prison, but Jack Abramoff did.  John McCain was a grown man during the Abramoff&#8217;s issue and it was McCain&#8217;s decision to cozy up to one of the central figures in the Republican culture of corruption.&#8221;    Barack Obama was 9 years old during the Ayers issue.</p>
<p>Republican&#8217;s grasping at straws and trying to throw the American public another strawman.</p>
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		<title>By: Webloggin &#187; McCain Camp Counters Misleading Obama Ad, Ties Obama to American Terrorist William Ayers</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/comment-page-1/#comment-94490</link>
		<dc:creator>Webloggin &#187; McCain Camp Counters Misleading Obama Ad, Ties Obama to American Terrorist William Ayers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 13:35:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10425#comment-94490</guid>
		<description>[...] “The question now is, will Barack Obama immediately call on the University of Illinois to release all of the records they are currently withholding to shed further light on Senator Obama’s relationship with this unrepentant terrorist?” —McCain spokesman Brian Rogers via STACLU [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] “The question now is, will Barack Obama immediately call on the University of Illinois to release all of the records they are currently withholding to shed further light on Senator Obama’s relationship with this unrepentant terrorist?” —McCain spokesman Brian Rogers via STACLU [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Alan</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/comment-page-1/#comment-94488</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 12:36:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10425#comment-94488</guid>
		<description>Carl, please show us the &quot;outright lies&quot; concerning Ayers, Wright, Rezko, etc. in which Obama has been &quot;caught.&quot;  Your claim is very precise, but it is also serious, and a very serious and precise claim needs very serious and precise evidence behind it.

Please also note that garden-variety political &quot;spin&quot; regarding such matters is so ubiquitous that if it disqualifies any politician, it would disqualify almost all of them.  Please also note that mis-statements are not necessarily lies.  A lie is a statement that the speaker knows to be false.  So in order to demonstrate a claim that someone has uttered &quot;outright lies,&quot; one would need to show both that the statement is false and offer evidence that the person who offered the statement knew it to be false at the time (I understand that conclusive evidence is seldom available, but I can think of a number of examples where teh evidence is overwhelming if not conclusive).  For instance, when witnesses to an accident recall the details differently, it is not necessarily the case that one of them is lying; but when we can show that the two stories were recently identical and that one of them only changed when it became apparent that changing the story would change the outcome in favor of the witness who story changed, then we have pretty good evidence of &quot;outrageous lies.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carl, please show us the &#8220;outright lies&#8221; concerning Ayers, Wright, Rezko, etc. in which Obama has been &#8220;caught.&#8221;  Your claim is very precise, but it is also serious, and a very serious and precise claim needs very serious and precise evidence behind it.</p>
<p>Please also note that garden-variety political &#8220;spin&#8221; regarding such matters is so ubiquitous that if it disqualifies any politician, it would disqualify almost all of them.  Please also note that mis-statements are not necessarily lies.  A lie is a statement that the speaker knows to be false.  So in order to demonstrate a claim that someone has uttered &#8220;outright lies,&#8221; one would need to show both that the statement is false and offer evidence that the person who offered the statement knew it to be false at the time (I understand that conclusive evidence is seldom available, but I can think of a number of examples where teh evidence is overwhelming if not conclusive).  For instance, when witnesses to an accident recall the details differently, it is not necessarily the case that one of them is lying; but when we can show that the two stories were recently identical and that one of them only changed when it became apparent that changing the story would change the outcome in favor of the witness who story changed, then we have pretty good evidence of &#8220;outrageous lies.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Pirate's Cove</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/comment-page-1/#comment-94487</link>
		<dc:creator>Pirate's Cove</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 12:11:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10425#comment-94487</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;McCain Camp Goes For Jugular...&lt;/strong&gt;

A press release from Camp McCain via The Corner
Please see comment from me on Barack Obama’s new ad supposedly running in Georgia:
“Barack Obama’s ad is ridiculous. Because of John McCain, corruption was exposed and people like Jack Abramoff went......</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>McCain Camp Goes For Jugular&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>A press release from Camp McCain via The Corner<br />
Please see comment from me on Barack Obama’s new ad supposedly running in Georgia:<br />
“Barack Obama’s ad is ridiculous. Because of John McCain, corruption was exposed and people like Jack Abramoff went&#8230;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: McCain Camp Goes For Jugular &#124; McCain Blogs</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/comment-page-1/#comment-94486</link>
		<dc:creator>McCain Camp Goes For Jugular &#124; McCain Blogs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 12:10:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10425#comment-94486</guid>
		<description>[...] Stop The ACLU, which also links to Doug Ross, who tears apart the Barry&#8217;s camps insinuations about [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Stop The ACLU, which also links to Doug Ross, who tears apart the Barry&#8217;s camps insinuations about [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Big Dogs Weblog</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/comment-page-1/#comment-94484</link>
		<dc:creator>Big Dogs Weblog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 10:06:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10425#comment-94484</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;Obama learns what a counter punch is...&lt;/strong&gt;

Barack Hussein Obama woke up this morning and found himself five points behind John Sidney McCain.  This after he suffered a serious blow at the Saddleback forum that saw all but the most seriously mentally ill calling it a big win for McCain.  Obama a...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Obama learns what a counter punch is&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>Barack Hussein Obama woke up this morning and found himself five points behind John Sidney McCain.  This after he suffered a serious blow at the Saddleback forum that saw all but the most seriously mentally ill calling it a big win for McCain.  Obama a&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Carl</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/20/obama-links-mccain-to-abromoff-mccain-fires-back-linking-obama-to-ayers/comment-page-1/#comment-94477</link>
		<dc:creator>Carl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Aug 2008 05:53:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10425#comment-94477</guid>
		<description>ralph, one is known by the company one keeps. A one-time aquaintance could be excusable, but Obama associated with Ayers, Wright, Rezko, and a host of other unsavory and shady characters for extended periods of time therefor it is extremely relevant in terms of Obama&#039;s character. Furthermore, Obama&#039;s been caught in many outright lies, self-contradictory statements and hard-to-believe statements concerning these individuals as well as his own past making Obama less than trustworthy and completely disqualifying him for the Presidency IMHO.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ralph, one is known by the company one keeps. A one-time aquaintance could be excusable, but Obama associated with Ayers, Wright, Rezko, and a host of other unsavory and shady characters for extended periods of time therefor it is extremely relevant in terms of Obama&#8217;s character. Furthermore, Obama&#8217;s been caught in many outright lies, self-contradictory statements and hard-to-believe statements concerning these individuals as well as his own past making Obama less than trustworthy and completely disqualifying him for the Presidency IMHO.</p>
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