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	<title>Comments on: Forget your religious beliefs.  We&#8217;ve got an agenda to push!</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/19/forget-your-religious-beliefs-weve-got-an-agenda-to-push/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/19/forget-your-religious-beliefs-weve-got-an-agenda-to-push/</link>
	<description>Beating Them With Their Own Sickle And Hammer</description>
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		<title>By: A Second Hand Conjecture &#187; Not Free to Choose How I Practice My Profession</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/19/forget-your-religious-beliefs-weve-got-an-agenda-to-push/comment-page-1/#comment-94434</link>
		<dc:creator>A Second Hand Conjecture &#187; Not Free to Choose How I Practice My Profession</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 06:46:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10366#comment-94434</guid>
		<description>[...] Stop the ACLU&#8220;Justice Joyce Kennard wrote that two Christian fertility doctors who refused to artificially inseminate a lesbian have neither a free speech right nor a religious exemption from the state’s law, which “imposes on business establishments certain antidiscrimination obligations.”  addthis_url = &#039;http%3A%2F%2Fasecondhandconjecture.com%2Findex.php%2F2008%2F08%2F20%2Fnot-free-to-choose-how-i-practice-my-profession%2F&#039;; addthis_title = &#039;Not+Free+to+Choose+How+I+Practice+My+Profession&#039;; addthis_pub = &#039;&#039;;   Sphere: Related Content [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Stop the ACLU&#8220;Justice Joyce Kennard wrote that two Christian fertility doctors who refused to artificially inseminate a lesbian have neither a free speech right nor a religious exemption from the state’s law, which “imposes on business establishments certain antidiscrimination obligations.”  addthis_url = &#8216;http%3A%2F%2Fasecondhandconjecture.com%2Findex.php%2F2008%2F08%2F20%2Fnot-free-to-choose-how-i-practice-my-profession%2F&#8217;; addthis_title = &#8216;Not+Free+to+Choose+How+I+Practice+My+Profession&#8217;; addthis_pub = &#8221;;   Sphere: Related Content [...]</p>
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		<title>By: N</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/19/forget-your-religious-beliefs-weve-got-an-agenda-to-push/comment-page-1/#comment-94428</link>
		<dc:creator>N</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 04:13:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10366#comment-94428</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;And last I checked, offending someone is not against the law.&lt;/i&gt;

Well, that&#039;s debatable. Is it against the law to &quot;hurt feelings&quot;? No. But are there laws that punish offenders for offending citizens? Yes. Sexual harassment laws for one. Hate crime law.  Also, decency laws. I draw no direct argument from any of the aforementioned examples, but there are precedents for laws preventing offense to private citizens. 

Let&#039;s not forget that the plaintiff in this case argued that she had to go outside of her employer&#039;s health plan in order to receive successful medical treatment, forcing her to pay more for services than a heterosexual patient would have had to. I haven&#039;t read the brief, but I would not be surprised to see this as one of the underlying reasons for the court&#039;s decision.

The clinic probably should have considered what medical plans it would and would not have accepted, or at least offered some sort of disclaimer as to who it would provide services for and what those services would include. Otherwise, it should have expected clients of either sexual orientation and/or a discrimination lawsuit upon refusal to service homosexual customers/patients.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>And last I checked, offending someone is not against the law.</i></p>
<p>Well, that&#8217;s debatable. Is it against the law to &#8220;hurt feelings&#8221;? No. But are there laws that punish offenders for offending citizens? Yes. Sexual harassment laws for one. Hate crime law.  Also, decency laws. I draw no direct argument from any of the aforementioned examples, but there are precedents for laws preventing offense to private citizens. </p>
<p>Let&#8217;s not forget that the plaintiff in this case argued that she had to go outside of her employer&#8217;s health plan in order to receive successful medical treatment, forcing her to pay more for services than a heterosexual patient would have had to. I haven&#8217;t read the brief, but I would not be surprised to see this as one of the underlying reasons for the court&#8217;s decision.</p>
<p>The clinic probably should have considered what medical plans it would and would not have accepted, or at least offered some sort of disclaimer as to who it would provide services for and what those services would include. Otherwise, it should have expected clients of either sexual orientation and/or a discrimination lawsuit upon refusal to service homosexual customers/patients.</p>
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		<title>By: SpideyTerry</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/19/forget-your-religious-beliefs-weve-got-an-agenda-to-push/comment-page-1/#comment-94418</link>
		<dc:creator>SpideyTerry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 02:28:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10366#comment-94418</guid>
		<description>I see why this was necessary since the Christian doctors did everything to prevent this woman from being impregnated. What, they didn&#039;t? They even referred her to someone else for the job? Well, then, I guess this woman was just being a greedy, pain in the butt. Expect her to sue McDonalds, Burger King or some other fast food place for making her fat.

By the way, if these doctors were Jewish or Muslim, I think there would&#039;ve been a &#039;slightly&#039; different attitude from the court.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I see why this was necessary since the Christian doctors did everything to prevent this woman from being impregnated. What, they didn&#8217;t? They even referred her to someone else for the job? Well, then, I guess this woman was just being a greedy, pain in the butt. Expect her to sue McDonalds, Burger King or some other fast food place for making her fat.</p>
<p>By the way, if these doctors were Jewish or Muslim, I think there would&#8217;ve been a &#8217;slightly&#8217; different attitude from the court.</p>
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		<title>By: James</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/19/forget-your-religious-beliefs-weve-got-an-agenda-to-push/comment-page-1/#comment-94416</link>
		<dc:creator>James</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 02:04:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10366#comment-94416</guid>
		<description>While it is true that homosexuality is not against the law, it IS against the law to force someone to go against their faith and the beliefs espoused in that faith as long as it does not go against the laws of the United States.  

And last I checked, offending someone is not against the law.  Show me where it is against the law and I&#039;ll gladly take it back.  Goodness knows, the courts don&#039;t mind offending those that hold Judeo-Christian values.  

Now, I realize this is about doctors refusing to serve an individual.  But, this is a service that is not necessary for sustaining life, and they can find someone else to perform the service.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While it is true that homosexuality is not against the law, it IS against the law to force someone to go against their faith and the beliefs espoused in that faith as long as it does not go against the laws of the United States.  </p>
<p>And last I checked, offending someone is not against the law.  Show me where it is against the law and I&#8217;ll gladly take it back.  Goodness knows, the courts don&#8217;t mind offending those that hold Judeo-Christian values.  </p>
<p>Now, I realize this is about doctors refusing to serve an individual.  But, this is a service that is not necessary for sustaining life, and they can find someone else to perform the service.</p>
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		<title>By: Wayne</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/19/forget-your-religious-beliefs-weve-got-an-agenda-to-push/comment-page-1/#comment-94411</link>
		<dc:creator>Wayne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Aug 2008 00:23:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10366#comment-94411</guid>
		<description>Linked to your post from &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.jeremiahfilms.com/released/news/081908.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Special rights trumps doctors religious rights&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Linked to your post from <a href="http://www.jeremiahfilms.com/released/news/081908.html" rel="nofollow">Special rights trumps doctors religious rights</a></p>
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		<title>By: N</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/19/forget-your-religious-beliefs-weve-got-an-agenda-to-push/comment-page-1/#comment-94408</link>
		<dc:creator>N</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 23:26:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10366#comment-94408</guid>
		<description>Crack dealers, child molesters, rapists, and murderers break the law for being crack dealers, child molesters, rapists, and murderers.

Also, arguing that the doctors didn&#039;t brand her &quot;a dirty queer&quot; and legitimizing a comparison between homosexual individuals to criminals is contradictory.  

Regardless of personal moral convictions, a homosexual person does not break the law for being homosexual. Drawing false parallels based only on personal morals without considering the legal context and implications hurts our ability to have a substantive discussion and do not help your argument.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Crack dealers, child molesters, rapists, and murderers break the law for being crack dealers, child molesters, rapists, and murderers.</p>
<p>Also, arguing that the doctors didn&#8217;t brand her &#8220;a dirty queer&#8221; and legitimizing a comparison between homosexual individuals to criminals is contradictory.  </p>
<p>Regardless of personal moral convictions, a homosexual person does not break the law for being homosexual. Drawing false parallels based only on personal morals without considering the legal context and implications hurts our ability to have a substantive discussion and do not help your argument.</p>
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		<title>By: Common Sense</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2008/08/19/forget-your-religious-beliefs-weve-got-an-agenda-to-push/comment-page-1/#comment-94407</link>
		<dc:creator>Common Sense</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Aug 2008 23:14:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.stoptheaclu.com/?p=10366#comment-94407</guid>
		<description>Perhaps Christian doctors in CA should move their practices to a state where they&#039;re allowed their religious freedom as stated in the Constitution.

What this woman really wanted was money.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps Christian doctors in CA should move their practices to a state where they&#8217;re allowed their religious freedom as stated in the Constitution.</p>
<p>What this woman really wanted was money.</p>
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