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	<title>Comments on: ACLU Reveal America&#8217;s Torture Techniques</title>
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	<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/</link>
	<description>Beating Them With Their Own Sickle And Hammer</description>
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		<title>By: meatbrain</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/comment-page-1/#comment-52127</link>
		<dc:creator>meatbrain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 10:20:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stoptheaclu.dreamhosters.com/archives/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/#comment-52127</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;&quot;Meathead, you are twisting what Bush said to seem like he is calling for Gitmo to be closed.&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;
	I reported what he said -- nothing more. What, exactly, was &quot;twisted&quot;? How, exactly, did I &quot;twist&quot; Bush&#039;s statement?

	&lt;strong&gt;&quot;And I am not gonna go digging through archives for an ACLU quote about closing Gitmo.&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;
	Say what you really mean: You cannot answer the question.

	&lt;strong&gt;&quot;BUt just for fun here is one of their guys stating Bush should close it down and have trials for the mooj&#039;s in there;

	&quot;&quot;The president does not need the Supreme Court&#039;s authorization to close down Guantánamo or to give the detainees held there a fair trial,&quot; Steven R. Shapiro, legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union, said in a statement. &quot;President Bush has had four years to do so. He should act immediately and stop making excuses for continuing to violate the Constitution by holding hundreds of men without charges.&quot;&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;
	In that passage, Shapiro does not say that Bush &quot;should close [Gitmo] down&quot;. He points out -- correctly -- that Bush does not need Supreme Court authorization to close the detention center.

	Thanks for the lie, Kender. And for proving &lt;em&gt;again&lt;/em&gt; that you are afraid of my questions. Here&#039;s another chance to do so:

	Exactly what has the ACLU said about the closure of Gitmo, and exactly what is it that the manner in which their statement was made is supposed to prove about the organization?

	Exactly what facts have I &quot;twisted&quot; in this instance?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>&#8220;Meathead, you are twisting what Bush said to seem like he is calling for Gitmo to be closed.&#8221;</strong><br />
	I reported what he said &#8212; nothing more. What, exactly, was &#8220;twisted&#8221;? How, exactly, did I &#8220;twist&#8221; Bush&#8217;s statement?</p>
<p>	<strong>&#8220;And I am not gonna go digging through archives for an ACLU quote about closing Gitmo.&#8221;</strong><br />
	Say what you really mean: You cannot answer the question.</p>
<p>	<strong>&#8220;BUt just for fun here is one of their guys stating Bush should close it down and have trials for the mooj&#8217;s in there;</p>
<p>	&#8220;&#8221;The president does not need the Supreme Court&#8217;s authorization to close down Guantánamo or to give the detainees held there a fair trial,&#8221; Steven R. Shapiro, legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union, said in a statement. &#8220;President Bush has had four years to do so. He should act immediately and stop making excuses for continuing to violate the Constitution by holding hundreds of men without charges.&#8221;"</strong><br />
	In that passage, Shapiro does not say that Bush &#8220;should close [Gitmo] down&#8221;. He points out &#8212; correctly &#8212; that Bush does not need Supreme Court authorization to close the detention center.</p>
<p>	Thanks for the lie, Kender. And for proving <em>again</em> that you are afraid of my questions. Here&#8217;s another chance to do so:</p>
<p>	Exactly what has the ACLU said about the closure of Gitmo, and exactly what is it that the manner in which their statement was made is supposed to prove about the organization?</p>
<p>	Exactly what facts have I &#8220;twisted&#8221; in this instance?</p>
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		<title>By: kender</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/comment-page-1/#comment-52128</link>
		<dc:creator>kender</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 10:08:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stoptheaclu.dreamhosters.com/archives/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/#comment-52128</guid>
		<description>Meathead, you are twisting what Bush said to seem like he is calling for Gitmo to be closed.  Anyone that reads his entire quote can plainly see that while he may wish to close Gitmo, he realizes that it cannot be done right now.

	And I am not gonna go digging through archives for an ACLU quote about closing Gitmo.   BUt just for fun here is one of their guys stating Bush should close it down and have trials for the mooj&#039;s in there;

	&quot;&quot;The president does not need the Supreme Court&#039;s authorization to close down Guantánamo or to give the detainees held there a fair trial,&quot; Steven R. Shapiro, legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union, said in a statement. &quot;President Bush has had four years to do so. He should act immediately and stop making excuses for continuing to violate the Constitution by holding hundreds of men without charges.&quot;

	Thanks for the dollar, richard.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Meathead, you are twisting what Bush said to seem like he is calling for Gitmo to be closed.  Anyone that reads his entire quote can plainly see that while he may wish to close Gitmo, he realizes that it cannot be done right now.</p>
<p>	And I am not gonna go digging through archives for an ACLU quote about closing Gitmo.   BUt just for fun here is one of their guys stating Bush should close it down and have trials for the mooj&#8217;s in there;</p>
<p>	&#8220;&#8221;The president does not need the Supreme Court&#8217;s authorization to close down Guantánamo or to give the detainees held there a fair trial,&#8221; Steven R. Shapiro, legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union, said in a statement. &#8220;President Bush has had four years to do so. He should act immediately and stop making excuses for continuing to violate the Constitution by holding hundreds of men without charges.&#8221;</p>
<p>	Thanks for the dollar, richard.</p>
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		<title>By: meatbrain</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/comment-page-1/#comment-52129</link>
		<dc:creator>meatbrain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 09:35:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stoptheaclu.dreamhosters.com/archives/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/#comment-52129</guid>
		<description>For those not familiar with Kender&#039;s gambit, let me put it bluntly: He&#039;s afraid.

	I&#039;ve asked him questions he cannot answer, and his &#039;gimme a dollar&#039; routine is a litle fairy tale he concocted to run away from the questions without leaving the discussion. Poor thing, he simply does not realize how obvious his fear of answering straightforward questions has become.

	Exactly what has the ACLU said about the closure of Gitmo, and exactly what is it that the manner in which their statement was made is supposed to prove about the organization?

	Exactly what facts have I &quot;twisted&quot; in this instance?

	Run away again, little coward.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For those not familiar with Kender&#8217;s gambit, let me put it bluntly: He&#8217;s afraid.</p>
<p>	I&#8217;ve asked him questions he cannot answer, and his &#8216;gimme a dollar&#8217; routine is a litle fairy tale he concocted to run away from the questions without leaving the discussion. Poor thing, he simply does not realize how obvious his fear of answering straightforward questions has become.</p>
<p>	Exactly what has the ACLU said about the closure of Gitmo, and exactly what is it that the manner in which their statement was made is supposed to prove about the organization?</p>
<p>	Exactly what facts have I &#8220;twisted&#8221; in this instance?</p>
<p>	Run away again, little coward.</p>
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		<title>By: kender</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/comment-page-1/#comment-52130</link>
		<dc:creator>kender</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 09:25:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stoptheaclu.dreamhosters.com/archives/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/#comment-52130</guid>
		<description>Thanks Meat, another dollar.A better question would be (for a shorter answer) &quot;What haven&#039;t you twisted?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Meat, another dollar.A better question would be (for a shorter answer) &#8220;What haven&#8217;t you twisted?&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: meatbrain</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/comment-page-1/#comment-52131</link>
		<dc:creator>meatbrain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 09:08:55 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Exactly what has the ACLU said about the closure of Gitmo, and exactly what is it that the manner in which their statement was made is supposed to prove about the organization?

	Exactly what facts have I “twisted” in this instance?

	Exactly what does your continued evasion of these questions tell us about the basis of your argument?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Exactly what has the ACLU said about the closure of Gitmo, and exactly what is it that the manner in which their statement was made is supposed to prove about the organization?</p>
<p>	Exactly what facts have I “twisted” in this instance?</p>
<p>	Exactly what does your continued evasion of these questions tell us about the basis of your argument?</p>
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		<title>By: kender</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/comment-page-1/#comment-52126</link>
		<dc:creator>kender</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 04:33:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stoptheaclu.dreamhosters.com/archives/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/#comment-52126</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t care if you believe me or not meathead.....everyone else seems to be able to understand the difference between Bush&#039;s remarks and the ACLU and UN demands.

	Neither the ACLU nor the UN said anything close to &quot;We would like to have Gitmo closed but it is full of dangerous people.&quot;

	Their calls run along the lines of most lefty whining, which is &quot;CLOSE GITMO, RELEASE THE INNOCENT MUSLIMS!&quot;

	BTW meathead, thanks for the dollar. Everytime you hammer on this same stupid point, refusing to grasp reality, I get a dollar.

	GIMME MY DOLLAR!!!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t care if you believe me or not meathead&#8230;..everyone else seems to be able to understand the difference between Bush&#8217;s remarks and the ACLU and UN demands.</p>
<p>	Neither the ACLU nor the UN said anything close to &#8220;We would like to have Gitmo closed but it is full of dangerous people.&#8221;</p>
<p>	Their calls run along the lines of most lefty whining, which is &#8220;CLOSE GITMO, RELEASE THE INNOCENT MUSLIMS!&#8221;</p>
<p>	BTW meathead, thanks for the dollar. Everytime you hammer on this same stupid point, refusing to grasp reality, I get a dollar.</p>
<p>	GIMME MY DOLLAR!!!!!</p>
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		<title>By: meatbrain</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/comment-page-1/#comment-52158</link>
		<dc:creator>meatbrain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 03:02:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stoptheaclu.dreamhosters.com/archives/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/#comment-52158</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;&quot;...saying you&#039;d like to do something is far different than demanding the closure of Gitmo, which is what the ACLU and the UN are doing.&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;
	I see. You are now hanging your argument on the exact &lt;em&gt;way&lt;/em&gt; in which the desire to close Gitmo is expressed. Let&#039;s pursue that.

	Exactly what has the ACLU said about the closure of Gitmo, and exactly what is it that the manner in which their statement was made is supposed to prove about the organization?

	And you&#039;re continuing to evade a simple question, occasioned by yet another of your hasty accusations. Exactly what facts have I &quot;twisted&quot; in this instance?

	&lt;strong&gt;&quot;BTW, you can&#039;t require me to do anything, bubba.&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;
	You are correct in this regard. I shall rephrase:

	&lt;strong&gt;&lt;em&gt;If you wish to be believed&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;, you will be required to provide verifiable evidence to back up your answer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>&#8220;&#8230;saying you&#8217;d like to do something is far different than demanding the closure of Gitmo, which is what the ACLU and the UN are doing.&#8221;</strong><br />
	I see. You are now hanging your argument on the exact <em>way</em> in which the desire to close Gitmo is expressed. Let&#8217;s pursue that.</p>
<p>	Exactly what has the ACLU said about the closure of Gitmo, and exactly what is it that the manner in which their statement was made is supposed to prove about the organization?</p>
<p>	And you&#8217;re continuing to evade a simple question, occasioned by yet another of your hasty accusations. Exactly what facts have I &#8220;twisted&#8221; in this instance?</p>
<p>	<strong>&#8220;BTW, you can&#8217;t require me to do anything, bubba.&#8221;</strong><br />
	You are correct in this regard. I shall rephrase:</p>
<p>	<strong><em>If you wish to be believed</em></strong>, you will be required to provide verifiable evidence to back up your answer.</p>
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		<title>By: kender</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/comment-page-1/#comment-52159</link>
		<dc:creator>kender</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 02:46:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stoptheaclu.dreamhosters.com/archives/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/#comment-52159</guid>
		<description>BTW, you can&#039;t require me to do anything, bubba.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>BTW, you can&#8217;t require me to do anything, bubba.</p>
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		<title>By: kender</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/comment-page-1/#comment-52160</link>
		<dc:creator>kender</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 02:45:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stoptheaclu.dreamhosters.com/archives/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/#comment-52160</guid>
		<description>Meathead, bush said:

	&lt;strong&gt;&quot;I’d like to close Guantanamo, but I also recognise that we’re holding some people that are darned dangerous, and that we’d better have a plan to deal with them in our courts.&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;
	Just like he&#039;d like to bring our troops home, he&#039;d like to end poverty and he&#039;d like to bring about world peace.

	Anybody in their right mind would like to do these things, but saying you&#039;d like to do something is far different than demanding the closure of Gitmo, which is what the ACLU and the UN are doing.

	The fact that you cannot see the difference between &quot;I&#039;d like to do A&quot; and &quot;A must be done!&quot; speaks volumes of your complete lack of grasping the fine points of modern english.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Meathead, bush said:</p>
<p>	<strong>&#8220;I’d like to close Guantanamo, but I also recognise that we’re holding some people that are darned dangerous, and that we’d better have a plan to deal with them in our courts.&#8221;</strong><br />
	Just like he&#8217;d like to bring our troops home, he&#8217;d like to end poverty and he&#8217;d like to bring about world peace.</p>
<p>	Anybody in their right mind would like to do these things, but saying you&#8217;d like to do something is far different than demanding the closure of Gitmo, which is what the ACLU and the UN are doing.</p>
<p>	The fact that you cannot see the difference between &#8220;I&#8217;d like to do A&#8221; and &#8220;A must be done!&#8221; speaks volumes of your complete lack of grasping the fine points of modern english.</p>
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		<title>By: meatbrain</title>
		<link>http://www.stoptheaclu.com/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/comment-page-1/#comment-52162</link>
		<dc:creator>meatbrain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 02:14:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://stoptheaclu.dreamhosters.com/archives/2006/06/16/aclu-reveal-americas-torture-techniques/#comment-52162</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;&quot;Any cretin save your stupid [edited] can see that Bush’s remark was one showing he harbors the regret that he cannot close Gitmo because it harbors people that are too dangerous to release.&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;
	Perhaps he does regret not being able to close Gitmo. Unlike you, Kender, I do not pretend to possess telepathic abilities.

	It is so far undisputed that &lt;em&gt;Bush does want to close Gitmo&lt;/em&gt;. This is the same want that the ACLU and the UN are being excoriated for in this comment thread.

	You tell me that Bush wants to close Gitmo. And you tell me that the ACLU and the UN want to close Gitmo. I still see no explanation for the difference in how those two are interpreted. You haven&#039;t even made an attempt at an explanation.

	And you&#039;ve left yet another question unanswered: How exactly did I &quot;claim&quot; this was said by President Bush, Kender?

	&lt;strong&gt;&quot;You constantly twist the facts...&quot;&lt;/strong&gt;
	Provide specifics, please. Exactly what facts have been &quot;twisted&quot; in this instance? You will be required to provide verifiable evidence to back up your answer (if any), of course.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>&#8220;Any cretin save your stupid [edited] can see that Bush’s remark was one showing he harbors the regret that he cannot close Gitmo because it harbors people that are too dangerous to release.&#8221;</strong><br />
	Perhaps he does regret not being able to close Gitmo. Unlike you, Kender, I do not pretend to possess telepathic abilities.</p>
<p>	It is so far undisputed that <em>Bush does want to close Gitmo</em>. This is the same want that the ACLU and the UN are being excoriated for in this comment thread.</p>
<p>	You tell me that Bush wants to close Gitmo. And you tell me that the ACLU and the UN want to close Gitmo. I still see no explanation for the difference in how those two are interpreted. You haven&#8217;t even made an attempt at an explanation.</p>
<p>	And you&#8217;ve left yet another question unanswered: How exactly did I &#8220;claim&#8221; this was said by President Bush, Kender?</p>
<p>	<strong>&#8220;You constantly twist the facts&#8230;&#8221;</strong><br />
	Provide specifics, please. Exactly what facts have been &#8220;twisted&#8221; in this instance? You will be required to provide verifiable evidence to back up your answer (if any), of course.</p>
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